Conroy promises filter review at 10,000 URLs

 

Technical review planned if blacklist gets bloated.

The Federal Government plans to undertake a technical review of its Refused Classification (RC) Content blacklist if and when it reaches 10,000 web addresses.

In an official response to parliamentary questions on notice yesterday, Communications Minister Stephen Conroy said ISP-level filtering of 10,000 URLs would have no discernable impact on network speeds.

He addressed suggestions noted in Enex TestLabs's 2009 Content Filtering Trial Report that 10,000 URLs may be a tipping point for load/performance degradation. At the time of the Enex study, the blacklist contained little over 1,000 URLs.

"The Government will monitor the number of URLs contained on the Refused Classification Content list and liaise with ISPs if the list begins to approach 10,000," Conroy said.

"If the list approaches 10,000 URLs, the Government will undertake a technical review of filtering a larger list of URLs."

The RC Content blacklist is expected to include Australian Communications and Media Authority's (ACMA) blacklist as well as URLs from overseas agencies.

Because the filter was intended to block only specific URLs and not entire domains, Conroy said, each item to be blocked would need to be listed specifically.

According to Electronic Frontiers Australia chair Colin Jacobs, there was a "significant risk" that the 10,000 milestone would be reached very quickly.

"If a website contained 10,000 images, each at a separate URL, how would this be handled by ACMA?" he wrote on an EFA blog.

"Or if somebody renamed a legal but RC image 10,000 times and uploaded them to a web server, and complained about all 10,000 URLs?

"Any such expensive and massive system needs to be more robust from the beginning," he said.

Conroy also revealed plans to develop new systems to manage, monitor and review items on the blacklist.

Currently, ACMA's blacklist is manually managed, and reviewed each quarter to determine if any URLs should be removed from the list. A replacement list is sent to filter software vendors after each review.

While Conroy did not reveal the cost of the review, each item of online content that was referred to ACMA cost the agency between $173 and $685 to investigate and classify last year.

Conroy considered the current manual review process appropriate for current, voluntary filtering arrangements. However, this was likely to change as RC Content list was established.

"There is no automated monitoring of URLs on the list currently maintained by [ACMA] and provided to filter software vendors," he said.

"[ACMA] intends to develop systems to manage the Refused Classification Content list once the regulatory framework for the list is in place and will consider the requirement for monitoring the list as part of this process."


Conroy promises filter review at 10,000 URLs
"10,000 URLS??? Conroy has to be joking - try Googling "how to steal a car". The result "About 16,700,000 results (0.25 seconds)" so the filter will have to handle these 16.7 million sites because ..."
By oz_ollie
 
 
 
Comments: 17
Ace
May 4, 2010 12:43 PM
If they could filter 27 million URLs it wouldn't be enough to bring any degree of 'safety'. Perhaps the ISPs could provide users with a method to crash the filtering application. This could be a satisfactory result. The govt has a filter that nearly works (like most apps) and the people have and internet that's nearly filtered.
--Ben--
May 4, 2010 2:20 PM
Here's a great idea - run a new trial NOW, BEFORE the system is in place, not later on when repealing the system isn't on the government's agenda.

What if it turns out that censoring more than 10 000 URLs is not feasible? Do it anyway?

They should conduct a new test which is double blind and actually test scenarios which will occur in the real world. No, the sham Enex trial was not scientifically valid.

There's millions of RC URLs out there on the web, so testing millions of URLs should be a priority.

Conroy is still interested in an evidence-based approach before implementing the system, right?
BrettWinterford
May 4, 2010 2:40 PM
@ Ben - by "evidence based", I assume you mean its been tested by pollsters?
longsword
May 4, 2010 3:17 PM
Sooner this hopeless idiot gets dumped the better. Not sure who his electorate is but vote him out at the next election and EVERYONE vote again Labor, if you don't want to vote Liberal fine but vote green/independant or donkey
Thysce
May 4, 2010 3:21 PM
--Ben--, he's only interested in the opinion of ACL and uneducated/ignorant parents who enjoy sheltering their precious "innocent" children.
AkiraDoe
May 4, 2010 3:36 PM
Unbelievable. Imagine if this was happening in a different portfolio, say one to do with transport.

Say a new, but old fashion toll booth style system was being setup on the Sydney Harbour Bridge to check that children in cars were wearing seatbelts because parents weren’t trusted to buckle up their kids.

The new system can handle only 1,000 cars per hour. If any more cars try to use the bridge they cannot be processed fast enough and the traffic backs up and eventually grinds to a halt.

That's ok at the moment because currently less than 1,000 cars will pass though the bridge per hour.

However, with the expected growth of the city it is forecast that many 1000's more cars will be using the bridge every hour very soon after the system will be put in place.

The Government have decided to build and put in place the system anyway to protect the children because something must be done and will only undertake a review of the system should more than 1000 cars try to use the bridge per hour.

Would the people of Sydney allow the Government to spend millions of dollars setting this up knowing that it will fail once more than 1000 cars start using the bridge, which has been forecast and then allow the Government to spend even more money trying to fix it?

Of course not, in fact I doubt everyone else around Australia, not just those in Sydney (who would be affected by this hypothetical situation) would approve of this massive waste of money.

I find it very, very sad that just because the ISP Filtering and the NBN are in a communications portfolio the majority of Australia's think they'll not be able to understand the issue and just agree with or eat up what ever Conroy spoon feeds them.

As I was trying to say with the example above, implementing an Internet filter would never be accepted and there would be a huge backlash if the people actually understood what is going on because just as the seatbelt checking stations above would wreck the transportation system in Sydney, ISP Filtering will cause massive problems to the Australian Internet.
AkiraDoe
May 4, 2010 3:41 PM
To my post above,

...ISP Filtering will cause massive problems to the Australian Internet.

But sadly all we keep hearing from Conroy is the Filters are 100% Accurate and there are no speed reductions, which even using their own report (the Enex report into the ISP Filtering Trial) is a complete lie.
AkiraDoe
May 4, 2010 3:53 PM
@longsword - Sadly Conroy isn't going anywhere. As far as I know he's at the top of the list to receive preferences so is pretty safe.

The best option is to vote below the line and keep as many of those preferences away from Labor as possible.
jeff
May 4, 2010 4:13 PM
Why is conroy so confident that the magical 10,000 number is all that he needs to worry about? Because tel$tra told him so?

The bottleneck of these "pass through" filters (marshal8e6) is the throughput. Which we all know can be swamped with just a single site by conroy's own admission ie youtube. Now all it takes is for a couple of RC sites to be hosted on a distributed cloud of servers (google, amazon etc) and the filter is broken.

Rather than pretend that 10,000 is the magic number that the filter starts to affect peoples speed, why doesn't he commit to actively monitoring and publishing the effect the filter is having in users THROUGHPUT AND LATENCY?

Me thinks would really make him and the other computer illiterates at the ACL think twice before making claims such as "no discernable impact on network speeds".
btone
May 4, 2010 4:30 PM
Aha, a room full of automated conbots should do the trick. Dufus daleks will automate the filter - "RC earl detekted - EXTERMINATE!"

Almost makes more sense than the deluded bleatings of an actual minister.
BlastedUser
May 4, 2010 5:30 PM
The 10,000 URL limit will eventually become a list of formulas (i.e. regular expressions). But even this is just a red herring. The point of the filters is to put the infrastructure that would enable ACTA compliance.
JoeSoap
May 4, 2010 6:32 PM
@AkiraDoe

Well written explains it better than I could. Time to link to your comment.
Mordd
May 5, 2010 1:13 AM
@AkiraDoe - I refer you to the NSW Government, and their Roads, Planning & Transport Ministers, although I agree with what you are saying, you picked the wrong analogy, there really are Ministers in Australia stupid enough to have employed that same bad logic already at a state level.
Axty
May 5, 2010 4:19 AM
@AkiraDoe Its not that they don't understand, its that if they disagree it means theyre a peadophile.

I'm amazed theyre actually bothering to place a filter with less than a million URL's in it, and even then that would be an insignificant number. Especially if its blocking only a certain page. One image. One video. One page instructing crime. One page the government doesn't want us to see.

Google marijuana to see how affective 10,000 sites will be in blocking RC content (eg Instruction/promotion of crime). And thats just one substance.

On a completely unrelated note, it turns out u can't view past 1000 search results on google. First time ive tried.
Daff42
May 5, 2010 9:21 AM
I'd say it's more like putting a road block on the harbour bridge, stopping every car to ask if it contains any criminals, while the criminals are all taking the tunnel.
anonymous
May 5, 2010 9:48 AM

"Conboy promises filter review at 10,000 URLs". That's a core promise, is it, like "the filter will be opt-in" before the last election?

Conboy the Grub probably thinks URL means UnReliable Lies.
oz_ollie
May 7, 2010 8:24 PM
10,000 URLS??? Conroy has to be joking - try Googling "how to steal a car". The result "About 16,700,000 results (0.25 seconds)" so the filter will have to handle these 16.7 million sites because they show people how to commit a crime which will be added to the RC list.
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